December 2, 2020

You Knew It Would Come, Sooner Rather than Later

By Chaplain Mike

Amid the discussions of how Christians should respond to Osama bin Laden’s death, you knew, you just knew we would learn sooner rather than later how this all fits into Biblical prophecy.

Since this is not my specialty, I will leave it to the “experts,” who with perfect hindsight, now tell us, “Of course! This is a key part of the perfect set-up for the end!”

In this spirit, here comes John Claeys, professor at Le Tourneau University, author of Apocalypse 2012: The Ticking of the End Time Clock—What Does the Bible Say? (No, I am not going to put up a link for this book. Sorry.)

According to Claeys, as cited in The Christian Post,

  • The Bible says God will put an end to terrorism, for that is the only way the Antichrist will be able to proclaim, “Peace and security!” (1Thess 5:3).
  • Islamic terrorism is the main obstacle to the end-times treaty Israel will make with ten national leaders, which is clearly taught in Scripture. “It will be that treaty which will begin the clock ticking on the final seven years leading to the return of Christ.”
  • Bin Laden’s death is therefore part of a process (and it may come quickly!) of ending Islamic terrorism.
  • We need to factor in that bin Laden’s assassination along with other developments in the region will also embolden the pro-democracy forces in Iran that will bring down the Iranian regime and create a context in which Israel will be more open to working on “peace and security,” leading to the end-times peace treaty.
  • Claeys concludes:

This means that bin Laden’s death was perfectly timed (by God, of course) to prepare for the end-times treaty with Israel, which will cause world leaders to believe they have achieved “peace and security”. As quickly as events in the Middle East have occurred in the past few months and weeks, the death of this avowed leader of terrorism could lead to a quick series of events that will significantly change the Middle East, leading to that seven-year treaty.

And, oh yes, look for the rapture of the Church to occur at the completion of that treaty. For Christians, that means to keep looking up!

Wait…this happened in time for Harold Camping’s prediction, too! My friends, (he said in a deep, serious voice) the pieces of the puzzle are falling into place.

Who thinks this stuff up?

 

Comments

  1. sigh…And how long before it gets tied in to Obama potentially being the Antichrist?

    Lord have mercy…

    • No doubt that will explain why Obama refused to release Bin Laden’s death photos. Bin Laden survived his fatal head wound and is plotting with the wily Kenyan from an undisclosed location. 🙂

      • Are fundelicals next going to ask for DNA evidence to make sure the birth certificate that was released is legitmate?

        • dumb ox says

          No, no, no. You see, Bin Laden was killed, because he had a copy of Obama’s real birth certificate. I’m surprised Trump didn’t come up with that one himself.

      • David Cornwell says

        If Osama swims ashore someplace, watch out!

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      And how long before it gets tied in to Obama potentially being the Antichrist?

      Probably already has. “Obamanation of Desolation, Enthroned in the White House” and all that. Conspiracy Theory logic is in effect, and Grand Unified Conspiracy Theories expand to consume EVERYTHING.

      • Pat Pope says

        Unfortunately Headless, it’s already been tied to Obama. A young lady at my church said after Obama was elected that he was the antiChrist. I asked her where she got her information and she said from the Bible and from other people. Pathetic…. So for those that already believe that, they will quickly see this as all part of his plan.

        • Headless Unicorn Guy says

          So for those that already believe that, they will quickly see this as all part of his plan.

          Grand Unified Conspiracy Theory in effect.

          The Dwarfs are for The Dwarfs, and Won’t Be Taken In.

      • “Obamanation of Desolation,” hahahahahaha! HUG, you always make my day!

        • Headless Unicorn Guy says

          It’s too obvious a pun to pass up; especially with the Official Christian (TM) attitude towards Obama.

    • Michael, every president in my lifetime has been called the AntiChrist. Yes, even Carter.

      It’s like being being a musician and having your song covered by Weird Al, or a pastor and being criticized by Ingrid. It’s all a rite of passage.

      • As I like to say, if I were willing to stretch and wrench out of context enough Bible verses, I’m pretty sure I could prove that Kathy Troccoli is the Antichrist.

      • …or a pastor and being criticized by Ingrid. It’s all a rite of passage. ain’t that the truth… 😉

    • You don’t understand. Obama was the anti-christ in 2008 when he was elected. Now there’s a new anti-christ somewhere. Haven’t you heard about the rotating anti-christ? It’s not a full-time position, but the position is filled on a “as needed” basis, and is a contract position and not hourly. That’s how he’s been around for 2000 years.

      Note: there’s nobody alive today who is 2000 years old, thus proving my rotating anti-christ scheme.

    • Does anyone really care about Osama or Obama? Or Teddy Kennedy’s Osama Obama. I think ol’ Teddy had it right both the same really. Just that Osama was straightforward and honest about his intentions.

  2. Dear Mike,

    I was conversing last night with someone over this very topic. I tried to show how irresponsible it is to use Revelation as if it were some crystal ball into the future. I pointed out that Revelation was written for an audience in the 1st century and prophetic statements for them, in terms of future events, could only be understood with reference to the present. In other words they would not have understood terms like “European Union, America, the Pope, etc.” But Revelation gets interpreted using such archaiac terms!

    Lord have mercy on us as we “forrest gump” our way through Revelation.

    Yuri

  3. Every generation thinks the end might happen in their life time. Even some of the apostles thought it would happen in their life time. so then, what can we conclude? The end might happen tomorrow or it might happen two thousand more years from now.

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      so then, what can we conclude?

      That so far, EVERYBODY who said “THIS IS IT!!!!” has been wrong.
      Dead Wrong.
      Batting Zero.
      And Batting Zero does things to credibility in general.

      • HUG, Like you, I remember this stuff from the ’70s (Hal Lindsey), but when does being fantastically wrong ever really damage anyone’s crediblity in the evangelical worldy? When was the last time a noted book-selling, hyper-publicized evangelical every publicly chastized another noted book-selling, hyper-publicized evangelical for screwing up “prophecy”? Yeah, it’s fun (and necessary) to ridicule this tripe, but it goes on and on.

        • Good point. Fundys point to the failed propehcies of Joseph Smith or the Mormons and use them to proclaim him as a fraud. Isn’t it only fair that the same standards be held to the fundys who make such fradulent predcitions? No one in the fundegelical church takes them on, rebukes or questions. Heck I remember when Iraqi Freedom was launched in March 2003 and my local pastor gave a sermon about how this could be the start of fulfilling Biblical prophecy. By having so many Amercian troops gathored in the “land of Babylon”

          8 years later..okay what the hell happened? If anything I think society and the secular media is too kind on fundelicals on this point. With the exception of what Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell would say they would refuse to nail them down or point this out.

  4. Wait. What? Is this a joke?

    Tap.

    Tap.

    Tap.

    Is this thing even on?

    Aren’t we supposed to be lookin’ Up anyways?

    I think I need a nap. G’nite.

    • That is the most sensible idea of them all, Rebekah. It’s naptime at the iMonastery. Everyone get their blankie.

      ZZZZzzzzzz….

  5. I wish I knew were this stuff comes from. Sometimes I think you are kidding when stuff likes this keeps popping up. I never thought it would come up, and to be honest this was the last thing on my mind when it came to the US government hunting down and killing Osama Bin Laden. I hate to disappoint those who like to place Bin Laden’s death in “Biblical prophecy” but there will likely be another person who will rise and carry the “battle” forward in Bin Laden’s place. That said…I’m relieved that he is gone.

    But why are fundegelicals so obsessed with Biblical prophecy and End Times? Why are so many attached to it? Can’t they live normal, loving lives instead of having orgasms of glee as they think they are going to fly into the sky while humanity is destroyed? Why the morbid smirking based satisfaction and obsession with the death of others? Why can’t Christians focus on the basics? Basics such as loving your neighbor, caring for your co-worker, looking out for that elderly person in the nursing home, or visiting the person near death in the hospice? Or being able to hang out with an agnostic and discuss things normally and be willing to share life?

    I remember when 9-11 happened I was in Crusade in the upper Midwest. Some were (Eagle reaches for his barf bag…) almost filled with glee that the World Trade Center was attacked. Can you believe that? Can you imagine Jesus acting like that? Why…? Because the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon meant we are in the End Times and that the rapture will happen any day.

    I think fundegelicals at times are their own worst enemy.

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      I remember when 9-11 happened I was in Crusade in the upper Midwest. Some were (Eagle reaches for his barf bag…) almost filled with glee that the World Trade Center was attacked. Can you believe that? Can you imagine Jesus acting like that? Why…? Because the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon meant we are in the End Times and that the rapture will happen any day.

      They said exactly the same things about the First Gulf War in 1991. (I remember all the books on it.) And the Yom Kippur War in 1973. (Though Comet Kohoutek in 1974 seemed to be a strictly-local Rapture Scare.) Rosh Hashanah Rapture Scare in 1975 (Rapture/Tribulation Timeline/Checklist worked out to the minute); Jupiter Effect Rapture Scare in 1981. Christians For Nuclear War, Left Behind Fever. Disaster after disaster reacted to with lip-smacking glee and climbing up to the rooftops (with End Time Prophecy books and checklists) so they wouldn’t have as far to Ascend.

      You know what helped fumigate my brain after the End Time Prophecy Locusts did their thing? I discovered 30-40-50-year-old End Time Prophecy books, each claiming their now-forgotten News Headlines were Fulfilling End Time Prophecy and Ye Ende Was Nighye. Almost word-for-word, just different forgotten News Headlines being cited as PROOF! Each and every time. Thirty… Forty… Fifty years ago.

      (Come to think of it, didn’t Late Great Planet Earth — the BIG End Time Prophecy book at the time — come out 30-40 years ago?)

      • cermak_rd says

        I once read a book called, “The Fighting Never Stopped” by Patrick Brogan. In it, he detailed an exhaustive list and details of all the conflicts from 1945 – publication (early 90s I believe). I think you could write a book about rapture scares (The Nonsense never Stopped?, The End Never Comes?…)

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      But why are fundegelicals so obsessed with Biblical prophecy and End Times? Why are so many attached to it?

      The same Secret Knowledge (Occult Gnosis) as the Conspiracy Theorist Gnostic — “But I KNOW What’s REALLY Going On!”

      Can’t they live normal, loving lives instead of having orgasms of glee as they think they are going to fly into the sky while humanity is destroyed?

      With the added appeal of The Ultimate Escape Fantasy followed by the Ultimate Revenge Fantasy. “See? See? I Was Right!! You All Are WRONG!!! Have Fun In Hell!!! HAW!!!! HAW!!!!! HAW!!!!!!”

      The Prophets of old called that day “The Great and TERRIBLE Day of God.” NOT a spectator sport with catered box seats.

    • Huh, huh, huh … he said “orgasms” …

    • “But why are fundegelicals so obsessed with Biblical prophecy and End Times?”

      Very simple – it’s built into our fundegelical DNA. If you think about, it our obsession with end times prophecy is foundational, right alongside Michael Spencer’s “wretched urgency.” After all, Jesus could come back tomorrow, right? At least, that’s what we’ve been proclaiming for some 200 years now.

      And you know better than many of us the extremes to which fundies and evangelicals will often go when they’re convinced they’re right, cuz the end justifies the means.

  6. Headless Unicorn Guy says

    I was wondering how long before somebody would shoot off his mouth along these lines. In a population of over 300 million, there’s always somebody. Factor in that Evanglical Christians are prone to Grand Unified Conspiracy Theory thinking and it becomes inevitable.

    Wanna bet “Third Eagle of the Apocalypse” (AKA The “It’s Prophesied” Guy) will be putting up another YouTube video? Or “5/21/2011” Camping will make a statement for All American Christians?

    Wait…this happened in time for Harold Camping’s prediction, too! My friends, (he said in a deep, serious voice) the pieces of the puzzle are falling into place.

    Don’t forget “All The End Time Prophecies Are Being Fulfilled Even As We Speak! We Might Not Have a 1978!! Or Even a 1977!!!” (whoops, old Prophecy!)

  7. when some low-life talks this talk to sell some books to gullible people, it’s one thing. conspiracy theorists are a dime a dozen. but when pastors and churches get caught up in this stuff, and when highly influencial people like Pat Robertson start talking, that’s when things get frightening.
    i watched a youtube video yesterday of Robertson and falwell talking about 9/11. so disgraceful. i hang my head in shame.

    • What was even more disgraceful is that many fundegelcals did nothing when such comments were made. Did Bill Bright come out and take on Jerry Falwell or Pat Robertson and call them on the carpet? No..

      What about Chuck Colson? No…
      Dr. James Kennedy of Corla Ridge? No…
      John MacArthur? No….
      D.A. Carson? I don’t think so….
      John Piper? No…..

      Do you see a pattern? What bothers me is that by being silent about stuff like this, it almost gives an approval. I mean they can’t be wrong? Can they? That’s how a minority thinks for a majority!!! Refusing to correct the minority and kick them off the stage.

      • I’m with you. The silence is kind of unnerving. Especially from those who claim most to be by the book.

        • Headless Unicorn Guy says

          Which book? Late Great Planet Earth or Left Behind: Volumes 1-22?

      • dumb ox says

        Look what LaHaye did to Hanegraaff when he had the audacity to suggest that dispensationalism is not the only eschatological view out there. He completely came of the hinges. One needs to think twice and seriously count the costs before going up against these boys.

  8. Hoping for Peace says

    Good grief. I didn’t think about that. More end times stuff. I’m going to have to practice selective avoidance at my local pentecostal church.

  9. Sorry, Chaplain Mike, but I remain unconvinced until someone quotes the ultimate authority – what does Nostradamus say?

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      Watch History or Discovery or NGC or Learning Channels and find out — they’ve all got “Nostradamus: 2012” et al on heavy rotation.

      • Gimme the exact quatrain, Headless! I demand to know where Obama/Osama/the Great Terror of the East is plainly described being slain by Creatures from the Sea in the West (obviously this refers to the U.S. Navy Seals, does it not)?

        🙂

  10. “4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.

    9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.” (Matt. 24:4-14)

    …the Bible says this kind of stuff is the “beginning of birth pains,” but Jesus clearly says at the end of this passage that the gospel will be preached in the whole world before the end comes, which has not happened yet. It’s important for people not to pluck one Biblical prophecy out, relate it to a major event, and then use that as proof that the end is here. Whenever people start saying that (INSERT MAJOR WORLD EVENT HERE) = end times, this passage of Matthew pops into my head.

    • How about the Chicago Cubs winning the World Series? Surely that has to amount to something….

    • Matthew’s gospel says a lot about false prophets. Chapter 7 came to mind bigtime during the runup to the second Iraq invasion (2003). I’ll paste a couple of verses, but it pretty much holds through the rest of the chapter.

      15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16You will recognize them by their fruits.

  11. What a picnic for the end times junkies and the conspiracy addicts. I didn’t know anybody loved Osama so much. He’s gotten more press dead than he ever did alive.

  12. Oops, we all forgot about our buddy Harold Camping at Family Radio. He is a bit miffed that Laden is getting more press than his May 21st date. Remember, we only have 17 days left.

    Crazies aside, it is most sad when fairly decent pastors get caught up in this stuff. A few years ago, Charles Stanley let himself get caught up in the first Gulf War, but I haven’t heard him say anything in years. I used to find myself caught up in it sometimes, thankfully Lord has mercy.

    • Oooh, I (and I’m sure many others) am waiting with BAITED BREATH for Campings May 22nd radio show. Maybe we should start a pool as to what his attitude will be….somber apology and repentance for false prophecy? Backpeddling? Justifying? Recalculating the date(“ooops..sorry folks, I meant 2013!) Is there ever any sort of remorse when these sort of stupidities are proven false? Methinks the circus will continue as ever…

      Nate

      • Headless Unicorn Guy says

        Based on past performance, probably Recalculating the Date.

        • That’s what he did in 1994. In fact, he started doing it before the date arrived; he began throwing in “or possibly 2011” with maybe a week to spare. Total CYA move — what a … false prophet.

      • dumb ox says

        I got it! He will declare that he, like Moses, interceded on the behalf of the lost to prolong the day until more lost sinners may be saved, and God relented by rescheduling the return of Christ. You heard it here first.

  13. dumb ox says

    Why the obsession with conspiracies and end-times count downs? The death of Bin Laden and the recent Donald Trump nonsense (and how he got so much attention) has raised new discussions about the connection between conspiracies and the human need for myth and legend. Fundamentalism represses the notion of mystery, but people still find an outlet – perhaps ghost stories, horror movies, or conspiracy theories.

    I don’t know how to solve this. Symbolic power needs to be restored to religious symbols to connect us with the eternal in a way that does not result in superstition. Otherwise, substitute will be sought out, empowering con men.

    • Damaris says

      From Isaiah Chapter 8:

      11 The LORD spoke to me with his strong hand upon me, warning me not to follow the way of this people. He said: 12 “Do not call conspiracy everything that these people call conspiracy; do not fear what they fear, and do not dread it. 13 The LORD Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy, he is the one you are to fear, he is the one you are to dread.

  14. Ken Anwari says

    “The Bible says God will put an end to terrorism, for that is the only way the Antichrist will be able to proclaim, “Peace and security!” (1Thess 5:3).
    Islamic terrorism is the main obstacle to the end-times treaty Israel will make with ten national leaders, which is clearly taught in Scripture. “It will be that treaty which will begin the clock ticking on the final seven years leading to the return of Christ.”
    Bin Laden’s death is therefore part of a process (and it may come quickly!) of ending Islamic terrorism.”

    WAIT A MINITE! By these statements, it would appear that the fundagelical prophysites will be welcoming the ending of Jihadist terrorism and the advent of world peace & security!!! Now if they could only take Jesus’ pesky little sound bite about “Blessed are the peacemakers” (Matthew 5:9) seriously, this could be the start of something significant!

  15. I don’t whether to laugh or cry! This brings back a twenty year old memory. When I was ten I told my mom that I wanted to be a teacher when I grew up. She said “you know Robin Jesus may come back before you grow up.” That led me to be terrified anytime I was alone because I thought that I had been left behind. I remember crying because the moon looked red one night and I couldn’t find my parents when I went inside. I knew it had happened and I was left. (The moon looking like fire I thought was a symbol of something) I started crying and then my dad walked in from the porch and asked me what was wrong. I lied and said that I fell outside. Like I was going to say “oh Dad I thought you and mom got raptured.” Interestingly, growing up in the Baptist church we heard about the END a lot. Not so much anymore. Now just random people on the radio talk it up. What’s up with that? Am I just missing the Sundays when it isn’t talked about?

    • You’re not the only one whose early years (even beyond childhood) were wracked with the fear of being left behind…

    • You reminded me of Tony Campolo’s bit about similar scare tactics in the Baptist churches of his youth. They’d preach about how you didn’t want Jesus to come back while you were in a (gasp!) movie theater. “And I was worried I’d go to a movie, and Jesus would come back … (long pause) … and I’d miss the end of the movie!”

    • The funniest thing is how many guys I talk to who grew up in youth group hearing about the rapture and had only one thought “What if the rapture comes and I leave this world a virgin?” Some of them claimed to use it as a pickup line. 🙁

      • Headless Unicorn Guy says

        I’m not surprised.

        How does “What if the rapture comes and I leave this world a virgin?” differ from “We’re All Gonna Die! I don’t wanna die a virgin! I gotta get laid just once!”?

        • Difference between American fundies and Islamic fundamentalist martyrs…70 virgins are already up there waiting for each of them. No angst.

  16. Who thinks this stuff up? People with too much time on their hands, maybe.

    I remember having nightmares after watching the “Thief in the Night” movie at a youth rally when I was in my teens. You can find it on youtube now and I saw some of it and thought, “Man, this movie moves s l o w.”

    I haven’t heard an end-times sermon in years. Thank goodness.

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      “Thief in the Night” was THE Big Thing during my first time in-country. Figured it was a Here-Comes-The-Antichrist and avoided it like ebola. I was already messed up by end-of-the-world scares and didn’t want to trigger another.

      Around 20 years later, I saw three clips of TitN on a PBS documentary about Christian subculture media. These are the exact words of my reaction:

      Clip 1) “That’s Thief in the Night? Looks more like Manos, Hands of Fate.”

      Clip 2) “Where’s Joel and the Bots?”

      Clip 3) “AAAAAAGH! WE HAVE MOVIE SIGN!”

  17. I’m curious. Is the end times chart shown on top an SDA one? Looks like it is. Doesn’t look traditional Dispy.

    • Martin Romero says

      Yes, it is. The whole thing is SDA through and through, but the bottom part about the “Investigative Judgment” is what shows it more clearly. The pictures used to illustrate it are the material nightmares are made of.

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      I read through an SDA End Times book (title What Jesus Said) in my junior college days, around the time I was being exposed to “conventional” End Times Choreography and Hysteria. And a couple years ago I got an SDA This Is It Apocalyptic booklet shoved under my front door.

      All I can say is the SDA choreography is unique, and is PROVEN from SCRIPTURE using the same proof-texts as conventional Pre-Trib Pre-Mil. Plus “year-to-daty” numerological calculations worthy of Howard Camping.

      (Did you know the REAL Mark of the Beast is Government-Forced Sunday Keeping? Through a coming National Sunday Law?)

  18. It’s times like this when I thank God I’m a preterist. 😉

    • It’s times like this I thank God Catholics are amillenialists (and the funny part of that is, I had no idea that *that* is what we were, until I started hanging around American Protestant blogs and seeing all these strange terms like “Rapture”, “preterist”, “dispensationalism” and went “Okay, better Google and find out do we have a position on this stuff – oh, look, we do! Huh, so that’s what we are, eh?”).

      🙂

      • Martha,

        I used to be one of those date-setting, apocalypse-giddy, secret-rapture dispensationalists until my Catholic friend challenged me to defend my position using the Bible alone and *without* reading between the lines, i.e., filling in the logical gaps of my convoluted system with fantastic scenarios ripped from the headlines. It suffices to say, it wasn’t long before I abandoned “futurism” and looked to the past for answers to all of my questions.

        James Stuart Russell’s The Parousia, published by Baker Books and available on Amazon.com, was a major influence on my thinking and led me to adopt an eschatological position in which I’ve been amazingly comfortable for nearly a decade now.

  19. I got over the need to obsess about the end times long ago and conspiracy theories make my stomach hurt. Who’s up for a dandelion break? Meet me in the meadow!

  20. Randy Thompson says

    Some years ago, I read a book that helped me make sense of this end-times obsession. (I think it was “Less Than Conquerors” by Douglas W. Frank, but I’m not sure).

    Fundamentalists look to a future that they’re certain about, and which they feel they have under control, rather than to a present where they are marginal and which they don’t control. It’s about being in control. Prophetic and apocalyptic speculations give certainty and therefore comfort to a people who are living in a world they can’t control and with which they are increasingly out of step. (The latter is not necessarily a bad thing, in and of itself, by the way.)

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      And just like Finding Noah’s Ark, a Certain Inevitable Apocalyptic Future gives them Cosmic justification. “SEE? SEE? I WAS RIGHT!! YOU’RE ALL WRONG!!! I’M RIGHT!!!! I’M RIGHT!!!!! I’M RIGHT!!!!!”

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      Supporting money quote from an IMonk thread (“Repenting of the Political Mindset”) about a month ago:

      In the devil’s theology, the important thing is to be absolutely right and to prove that everybody else is absolutely wrong. – Thomas Merton

  21. Dana Ames says

    Martha – Nostradamus! ROFL!

    Somewhat more seriously, my 2 cents as to who thinks this stuff up:

    People who believe that the apex of history is not the hill of Calvary and the Empty Tomb of AD 33, but is actually yet to come (when Jesus returns and kicks butt…).

    People who don’t pay attention to any theology but their own and refuse, for whatever reason, to at least consider what the larger church has taught in the last 20 centuries.

    People who are influenced by a rationalist-based, American-influenced secularism (yes, a number of Christians included, some of whom neither know nor care that this is what drives them – and we’re all swimming in it, friends …) that expects continued Progress, sees what’s coming in the Future as all that matters, is obsessed with Proof, divides reality into two stories and lobs anything “supernatural” up to the second storey, where it can be forgotten except when convenient to haul it out and parade it around to show how Correct (“Biblical”???) a person/group is.

    Sadly, there are folks like this in every Christian group.

    Lord have mercy on all of us, and on me, a sinner…

    Dana

  22. Let’s see… we have a eschatological framework introduced by a 19th century rogue, with more reference to Manichaeistic dualism than historical Christianity, and reeking of Gnosticism by claiming it to be the true New Testament hidden until these last days, and whose adherents portray themselves as the persecuted faithful remnant. I’m referring to Mormonism, of course. No, wait, there may be another possibility….

  23. My favorite End Times, conspiracy theory, twilight zone moment came when I was teaching the book of Revelation (from a thoroughly non-dispensational perspective) at a rural Southern Baptist church around the time when Cardinal Ratzinger was made Pope Benedict XVI.

    A woman took me aside after class and with a very serious, hushed tone said: “I know who the Antichrist is.”
    “Really?” I responded.
    “Yes, its the new Pope.”
    “Huh…”
    She replied (again, with a straight face), “It makes perfect sense.”
    **Quizzical look from me**
    “His name!”
    **Another quizzical look**
    Even more seriously, with lots of enunciation: “Be-ne-dict… As in… Benedict Arnold!”

    Ah yes… Don’t know why I didn’t see it before. Makes perfect sense!

    • Emily, I’m torn between banging my head on the table and rolling around laughing at that.

      Benedict Arnold – of course! But… but… what about the 15 other popes who took the name Benedict before him? Were they all the Anti-Christ too?

      What am I saying – of course they were!

      🙂

  24. What is man that thou are mindful of him? I read this post after reading about Grace. It’s the only thing that stands between us and lunacy.

  25. I’d like to suggest we explore the possibility that the whole pre-mil, pre-trib rapture/7 year tribulation, European Onion, Anti-Christ garbage we’ve been beaten to death with in the last (insert your age) years might be a doctrine of demons. (1 Timothy 4:1) Any takers for discussion?

    • Headless Unicorn Guy says

      Makes as much sense as any.

      “By their fruits ye shall know them,” and for me the fruits of such have been bad ones.

  26. Jessica B. says

    The world can’t end on May 21! It’s the day I graduate from high school! Wait, what time is Jesus coming back? I just want to get my diploma, then the end times can start. Though, I would prefer to have- at the very least- started my first year of college. Is there any way to request that Jesus goes with the 2012 end times date? Then again according to some the Mayan calendar and Nostradamus favor the 2012, so I have nothing to worry about. Until 2012…